ISIS-ISIL, question to a knowledgeable one

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John Q. Public
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Re: ISIS-ISIL, question to a knowledgeable one

Post by John Q. Public » Tue Dec 08, 2015 9:58 am

Cruiser wrote:So, would any President dare to veto foreign aid to Israel, each and every year by
the line item veto?
Nope. It would be political suicide.

Obama doesn't hate Israel, regardless of the rhetoric saying he does. He just disagrees with Netanyahu, same as the majority of American Jews. Who also don't hate Israel.
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Re: ISIS-ISIL, question to a knowledgeable one

Post by Parrotpaul » Tue Dec 08, 2015 10:04 am

FYI.....U.S. foreign aid to Israel: 2014 congressional report
<snip>

The 2014 report’s findings include:

•In 2007 the Bush Administration established a 10-year, $30 billion Israeli military aid package for fiscal years 2009 through 2018. The Obama Administration budgets have held true to this commitment, with $3.1 billion allocated for FY2014 and the same amount requested for FY2015.

•This FY2015 foreign military financing (FMF) level would constitute roughly 55% of the United States’ total FMF funding worldwide and would finance 23% to 25% of the overall Israeli defense budget — percentages that clearly demonstrate the U.S. commitment to Israeli security and Israel’s dependence on U.S. support.

•Since 2008 Congress has required the executive branch to submit biennial reports on “maintaining Israel’s Qualitative Military Edge (QME) over neighboring militaries.” The report states that “the rationale for QME is that Israel must rely on better equipment and training to compensate for being much smaller geographically and in terms of population than its potential adversaries.”

•In addition to the $3.1 billion in FY2015 funding, the Obama Administration also requested $96.8 million for joint US-Israeli programs and $175.9 million for Iron Dome, Israel’s short-range anti-rocket system. This funding is provided in regular U.S. defense authorization and appropriations bills and does not formally constitute direct bilateral aid.

•The Iron Dome system has cumulatively received more than $704 million in U.S. financial support, with an additional $235.3 million appropriated in the FY2014 appropriations act and the $175.9 requested for FY2015.

The U.S. has also assisted with the development of Israel’s David’s Sling long-range missile defense system, and since 1990, has contributed $2.365 billion to the Arrow Anti-Missile System, just under half of the program’s total cost.

•Up to 26.3% ($815.3 million in FY2014) of U.S. FMF to Israel may be used for procurement from Israeli defense companies, enabling Israel to build a domestic defense industry that ranks in the top 10 of arms suppliers worldwide. No other recipient of U.S. military assistance is granted this benefit.

•U.S. support isn’t limited to monetary gestures either. In 2008, the U.S. began the deployment of the X-Band Radar system on Israeli soil; an operation that remains U.S. owned and is staffed by U.S. troops. Not only is the X-Band system “far more capable of detecting incoming missiles than Israel’s natively produced radar system, but the United States has linked the X-Band to its global network of satellites in the U.S. Defense Support System.”

•The U.S. Defense Department also stores military supplies on Israeli bases in preparation for combat, and if needed, Israeli forces can request use of these supplies from the U.S. government in times of emergency, as happened in the 2006 conflict with Hezbollah. The value of the U.S. materiel stored in Israel increased to $800 million in 2010, with Congressional approval for up to $1.2 billion.

•The United States and Israel announced in 2010 that Israel will use $2.75 billion in FMF grants to purchase 19 F-35 Joint Strike Fighters. Originally expected to be delivered in 2015, the aircraft are now projected for a 2016-2017 delivery date. An advanced but extremely expensive aircraft, the F-35 has experienced technical and budgetary troubles for more than a decade.

The United States also provides Israel with financial assistance not related to defense. This includes:

•Since 1973 Israel has received annual grants from the State Department’s Migration and Refugee Assistance program to assist with the resettlement of migrants in Israel. Funding levels, which were at $60 million annually as recently as 2003, have decreased in recent years, with FY2014 at $15 million and the Obama Administration requesting $10 million for FY2015.

•In 2003 Israel received $9 billion in loan guarantees over three years for economic recovery. The law authorizing the guarantees stated that they could only be used within Israel’s borders prior to June 5, 1967. The U.S. Department of State later reduced the FY2003 loans by nearly $290 million because Israel continued the construction of settlements in the occupied territories and other actions. In FY2005 the available funds were cut by nearly $800 million, and Israel has not borrowed any funds since that year.

•In 2012 Congress passed and the president signed a bill extending the loan-guarantee program until September 2015. “As of 2014, Israel is still authorized to issue up to $3.8 billion in U.S.-backed bonds. In general, Israel may view U.S. loan guarantees as a ‘last resort’ option, which its treasury could use if unguaranteed local and international bond issuances become too expensive.”


http://journalistsresource.org/studies/ ... nal-report
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Re: ISIS-ISIL, question to a knowledgeable one

Post by Troglodyte » Tue Dec 08, 2015 11:27 am

There is no presidential line item veto.... ](*,) [url=ttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Line-item_veto_in_the_United_States]LINK[/url]

Many presidents sought it. Very few used it. Modified versions of it have been enacted and shot down.
Another Obama Legacy? The End of the Line-Item Veto
LINK

Line Item Veto for the President
LINK

The line item veto failed two years ago (2009) because the Democrat-controlled Congress refused to give the president of their own party (Barak Obama) this budget tool to eliminate excessive spending.
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Re: ISIS-ISIL, question to a knowledgeable one

Post by Brooke » Tue Dec 08, 2015 2:47 pm

JQP: He just disagrees with Netanyahu, same as the majority of American Jews. Who also don't hate Israel.
What do you mean the majority of Jews? How do you know that?
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Re: ISIS-ISIL, question to a knowledgeable one

Post by Parrotpaul » Tue Dec 08, 2015 3:32 pm

Because it's true. Most American Jews disagree with his politics.
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Re: ISIS-ISIL, question to a knowledgeable one

Post by Troglodyte » Tue Dec 08, 2015 4:07 pm

Paul, If you're talking about American Jews vs Obama, I agree..
If you're talking about American Jews vs Netanyahu, I seriously doubt that.
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Re: ISIS-ISIL, question to a knowledgeable one

Post by Omar Bongo » Tue Dec 08, 2015 4:12 pm

Most American Jews disagree with his politics

It's interesting that if a Democrat like the President stands up to Netanyahu it's the Christian Conservatives, not Jewish pols, who squawk about him being anti-Israel or coddling terrorists...

I wonder what they would say if Bernie challenged Bibi :-k
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Re: ISIS-ISIL, question to a knowledgeable one

Post by Parrotpaul » Tue Dec 08, 2015 4:17 pm

Paul, If you're talking about American Jews vs Obama, I agree..
If you're talking about American Jews vs Netanyahu, I seriously doubt that.


Why?
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Re: ISIS-ISIL, question to a knowledgeable one

Post by Wabash » Tue Dec 08, 2015 4:26 pm

Troglodyte wrote:There is no presidential line item veto.... ](*,) [url=ttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Line-item_veto_in_the_United_States]LINK[/url]

Many presidents sought it. Very few used it. Modified versions of it have been enacted and shot
Conservatives supported a line item veto until a Dem was elected president. Clinton used it and was immediately challenged by a group of potatoe farmers in Idaho who didn't want their subsidies cut.

More recently. A line item veto measure was approved in the HoR but failed in the Senate when it failed to get the required 60 votes. 41 GOP Senators voted to oppose the bill. It died.

The GOP was/is absolutely terrified of what Obama would do to their district pork barrel spending if he had line item veto authority.
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Re: ISIS-ISIL, question to a knowledgeable one

Post by Brooke » Tue Dec 08, 2015 7:30 pm

Who does Obama think he is to tell Netanyahu what to do in his own country? Our PC wuss for a president doesn't have a problem with terrorists no matter where they are. In Israel, San Bernadino, NYC, Paris or wherever.

Palestinians have proven over and over again that they don't want to live in peace. The Palestinians want to destroy Israel and kill all the Jews.
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Re: ISIS-ISIL, question to a knowledgeable one

Post by John Q. Public » Tue Dec 08, 2015 9:56 pm

Omar wrote:It's interesting that if a Democrat like the President stands up to Netanyahu it's the Christian Conservatives, not Jewish pols, who squawk about him being anti-Israel or coddling terrorists...
That's because Jews hate Israel.
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Re: ISIS-ISIL, question to a knowledgeable one

Post by Brooke » Tue Dec 08, 2015 11:10 pm

Jews do not hate Israel John.
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Re: ISIS-ISIL, question to a knowledgeable one

Post by Wabash » Wed Dec 09, 2015 5:13 am

Brooke wrote:Who does Obama think he is to tell Netanyahu what to do in his own country? Our PC wuss for a president doesn't have a problem with terrorists no matter where they are. In Israel, San Bernadino, NYC, Paris or wherever.
The hundreds of terrorist leaders that have been killed by this administration would disagree with you. Once again you cite an opinion with no substance.
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Re: ISIS-ISIL, question to a knowledgeable one

Post by Reconquista Primero » Wed Dec 09, 2015 9:58 am

Bev wrote: Who does Obama think he is to tell Netanyahu what to do in his own country?
Brooke: When the US is as beneficient with Israel as it is, that gives us the right to express an opinion. The leaders in Israel are free to ignore what we have to say or, if they feel that strongly about it, reject our aid. As I don't see Netanyahu turning back the aid, he obviously doesn't take serious offense to President Obama's suggestions.
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Re: ISIS-ISIL, question to a knowledgeable one

Post by cruiser » Wed Dec 09, 2015 10:13 am

Well, like it or not, Israel stabilizes the region, to the extent WWIII has not started,
if Israel were to fall that is what would happen within five to ten years, so, ya; keep giving
the money to Israel whether people like it or not, it's in the US primary interest, otherwise suit up and man the post.
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Re: ISIS-ISIL, question to a knowledgeable one

Post by Reconquista Primero » Wed Dec 09, 2015 10:24 am

Cruiser: I suspect you won't find anybody on this board who disagrees with you. :D
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Re: ISIS-ISIL, question to a knowledgeable one

Post by Parrotpaul » Wed Dec 09, 2015 10:29 am

In addition lots of the US largesse to Israel comes back to us in the form of weapons system contracts not to mention the many benefits of sharing Israeli technology.
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Re: ISIS-ISIL, question to a knowledgeable one

Post by Brooke » Wed Dec 09, 2015 9:28 pm

Wabash: The hundreds of terrorist leaders that have been killed by this administration would disagree with you. Once again you cite an opinion with no substance.
Hundreds of terrorist leaders? Hundreds? How do you know that?

And once again, you conveniently leave out facts that Obama could, should have, and should be doing much more. The Kurds need weapons, Jordan needs money, Obama didn't bomb the source of how ISIS earns its money at $1 million a day by bombing their oil resources for ENVIRONMENTAL REASONS. Babies, children, women and men are being tortured, enslaved, raped, beheaded and the president is concerned about the environment! He's sick!

He pretends to be morally righteous when in fact peoples' lives mean nothing to him. He is the leader of the free world and should be leading in the fight against this hideous evil that plagues the world. What does he want to do? He wants to bring them here so they can kill Americans and change our country. He's an idiot.
Who in their right mind uses a welcome sign to mean people who would come into their home uninvited, paid by their neighbors who are using their illegal labor, overrun the neighborhood, and refuse to leave?

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Re: ISIS-ISIL, question to a knowledgeable one

Post by Brooke » Wed Dec 09, 2015 9:41 pm

Reconquista, where did you come up with the idea that Israel should reject our aid? I doubt that any country has rejected our aid as long as we have been giving it.

Obama does more than just give unwanted advice to Netanyahu, he puts pressure on Israel to bend to his will and involves the UN to make it happen. I don't think Obama knows enough of the history of the region to give advice to Netanyahu or anyone else about what Israel should do or not do.

After all Obama made a deal with Iran that supposedly put rules in place regarding the development of nuclear weapons, which have been violated from the day after the signing of the agreement.

What does that tell you about Obama's stupidity? He guarantees that the biggest sponsor of terror in the entire world will receive a gift of $150 billion with which to purchase, create more weapons and recruit more terrorists including promising to help them create nuclear weapons over the next ten years. He may have seen to it that the Iranians will destroy the earth and all of us too.
Who in their right mind uses a welcome sign to mean people who would come into their home uninvited, paid by their neighbors who are using their illegal labor, overrun the neighborhood, and refuse to leave?

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Re: ISIS-ISIL, question to a knowledgeable one

Post by Wabash » Wed Dec 09, 2015 10:17 pm

Brooke wrote:
Wabash: The hundreds of terrorist leaders that have been killed by this administration would disagree with you. Once again you cite an opinion with no substance.
Hundreds of terrorist leaders? Hundreds? How do you know that?
I read. Your rant only proves that no matter what he does, you will criticize. #sad
They told me if I voted for Hillary Clinton the president would be emotional, impulsive, and unpredictable. They were right. I voted for Hillary Clinton and got a president that is emotional, impulsive, and unpredictable.

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