Black players protest

not4u13
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Re: Black players protest

Post by not4u13 »

This whole thing became a thing when Trump made it a thing. Prior to his statements fanning the flames of discord there were few protesters and much less attention paid to them. There were a few who had decided to use the very public platform to make a silent but noticeable statement calling for a widespread look at police violence against the black community. That's all. Trump made it a political issue.

Now, here we are, a few months after Trump's comments and the issue has died down with the general public. Players are still kneeling and TV has stopped showing the national anthem and calling attention to who is and who isn't kneeling.

Unfortunately the original intent has been overshadowed by the politics of it all. Some of the police departments are making changes to their training programs to give officers better guidance on how to protect themselves without escalating the situation. That appears to be working. When you have someone in power simply increasing the level of power to gain compliance, you are lighting a fuse. Truth is, this isn't just about blacks. This is about anyone who may encounter the police and not be immediately submissive. Those (of any race) that don't trust the police. Those who are mentally ill and those who may simply be confused. Departments are finding that changing their training is reducing the number of confrontational incidents overall, increasing officer safety.

Personally, when I have been pulled over I try to have a conversation with the officer. When they talk to me like I am a human being, it works better for everyone. When they treat me like a child being scolded by their father, I get a little angry. How hard is it to be nice?
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Re: Black players protest

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Papa John flip-flops. And should he fire himself?
Screenshot-2017-11-15 Papa John's apologizes for being 'divisive' over NFL protests.png
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Re: Black players protest

Post by Omar Bongo »

Comments from a couple of players about Trump musing about deporting players who protest during the anthem:

"I say 'disgusting' because of our First Amendment rights,'' Marshall said. "We have freedom of speech, right? Freedom to protest? Because somebody decides to protest something, now we have to be kicked out of the country? That's not how things should work, in my opinion. ... Just because somebody disagrees with something, or if I didn't stand for the anthem, or if I don't like what's going on, that's basically him saying I should be kicked out the country.

"We're supposed to have a conversation about things, talk about things, work things through. Everybody is not gonna agree on things, everybody is not gonna have the same opinion on things. So just because somebody disagrees or has an issue with something that's going on in this country, it doesn't mean that they should pack up and leave. That's absurd, in my opinion.''


Well said, IMHO.

Seattle wide receiver Doug Baldwin was no less opinionated, but kept it concise:
"He's an idiot. Plain and simple."

http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/2359 ... disgusting
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Re: Black players protest

Post by Wabash »

Forced patriotism is not freedom.
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Re: Black players protest

Post by Omar Bongo »

Next step is posture and facial expression regulations...
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Re: Black players protest

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They can be free in the locker room. \:D/
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Re: Black players protest

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Professor Fate wrote: They can be free in the locker room.
How very generous of you. The statement by trump was idiotic, and so is yours.
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Re: Black players protest

Post by Wabash »

Black men kneeling to quietly and silently protest police brutality is Unamerican.

White men waving the Nazi and CSA flags are considered patriots.

That's the world Trump has revealed.
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Re: Black players protest

Post by Bick »

This is the actual quote.

"You have to stand proudly for the National Anthem. You shouldn't be playing, you shouldn't be there. Maybe they shouldn't be in the country...the NFL owners did the right thing"

Which does it most resemble - "America, Love it or Leave it", or "we're going to deport you if you don't stand for the anthem"?
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Re: Black players protest

Post by Bick »

Omar Bongo wrote: Comments from a couple of players about Trump musing about deporting players who protest during the anthem:
Where did you read "deportation" in Trump's remarks?

Focusing on the real issue here, do you think an employer has the right to expect his employees to behave in such a way that supports his company? Or do you believe the employee can do pretty much whatever he wants regardless of the damage it may do to the company?
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Re: Black players protest

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If any of us repeatedly protested to espouse our political views at our place of employment, we'd likely be told to knock it off or we'd be gone. How is this any different?
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Re: Black players protest

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If your employer was requiring you to do something you're philosophically opposed to doing I think you'd have a pretty strong discrimination suit. Replace "anthem" with "prayer" and tell me what you think.

I gotta agree that forced patriotism is compliance, not patriotism.
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Re: Black players protest

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MDDad wrote:If any of us repeatedly protested to espouse our political views at our place of employment, we'd likely be told to knock it off or we'd be gone. How is this any different?
Out of curiosity, how many 'employers' force their employees to stand while they play the anthem?

Look for the player's union to formally object.
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Re: Black players protest

Post by Bick »

John Q. Public wrote: If your employer was requiring you to do something you're philosophically opposed to doing I think you'd have a pretty strong discrimination suit. Replace "anthem" with "prayer" and tell me what you think.

I gotta agree that forced patriotism is compliance, not patriotism.
If the actions of your employees led to your advertisers pulling their ads, would you be OK with that?
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Re: Black players protest

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Bick wrote: Where did you read "deportation" in Trump's remarks?
"You have to stand proudly for the National Anthem. You shouldn't be playing, you shouldn't be there. Maybe they shouldn't be in the country..the NFL owners did the right thing"

That's where people got the 'deportation" thing. I know what you're going to say and you can save it. What the president said was stupid and insulting, and you can run interference for him if you wish, but his meaning was as clear as it was ridiculous.
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Re: Black players protest

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Bick wrote: If the actions of your employees led to your advertisers pulling their ads, would you be OK with that?
Did that happen? I think everyone here understands and accepts that an employer has the right to regulate the conduct of his employees...up to a point. I think the league crossed the line here.
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Re: Black players protest

Post by Bick »

#1 reason for NFL ratings decline...anthem protests. Don't know the accurate estimate of what the financial hit that's attributed to that, but have read it's in the hundreds of millions.

https://www.broadcastingcable.com/news/ ... nes-171585
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Re: Black players protest

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Bick wrote: #1 reason for NFL ratings decline...anthem protests.
That's hard to believe. I know of no one who stopped watching football over the "protest issue". As an opponent of the protests, did you stop watching football?
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Re: Black players protest

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Many explanations have been given for the falloff in NFL ratings this season, including a backlash among fans to controversy surrounding players who protest by taking a knee during the National Anthem. A nationally representative survey of Americans conducted by Wall Street equities firm UBS finds that, in fact, is the No. 1 reason cited by those who said they watched less NFL coverage this year.

The finding -- part of a survey of 2,000 U.S. consumers conducted by UBS as part of its “Evidence Lab” -- is self-reported, but among those saying they watched less NFL coverage, 50% said they “don’t approve of National Anthem protests.” That’s up from the 30% who cited that reason when UBS conducted a similar survey a year ago.

The second-biggest reason was respondents saying they are not as interested in professional football, followed by the response that they are “not comfortable with players' off-field behavior."
https://www.mediapost.com/publications/ ... cited.html

For what it's worth, I did cancel my Sunday Ticket subscription. Apparently I wasn't alone.

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Re: Black players protest

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Bick wrote: If the actions of your employees led to your advertisers pulling their ads, would you be OK with that?
It would cause me to look at the situation and weigh my options. If I was requiring them to do something they morally objected to I'd think I'd see that and ask myself if we need to do it.

Since you asked the question of someone who runs a "business" that's supported by advertising, I'll say that I realized from the git-go that there are things I can require from posters and things I can't. The ad rates would go up if I put a 50-word minimum on posts, required that every post be well written and mention the subject of the thread or if i deleted every post that even hinted at being off topic or didn't need to be posted, but that would be stupid on my part, no? If I did that and lost traffic, I certainly wouldn't blame the posters.

You don't solve problems by simply blaming the other guy. You have to realize that maybe your own policy is causing the conflict. And sometimes it can pretty obvious. In this case, does the anthem really need to be played? It's a friggin' football game - an entertainment event, not a military ceremony. People don't expect demonstrations of patriotism before concerts or movies, why do they require it at a football game?
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