Cantlay vs Woods: Best High School golfer from OC?

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Omar Bongo
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Re: Cantlay vs Woods: Best High School golfer from OC?

Post by Omar Bongo » Wed Mar 15, 2017 10:16 pm

joefutbol wrote:The level of competition that Woods faced pales in comparison to today.
Much the same as Cantley's HS accomplishments do compared to Woods'...
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Re: Cantlay vs Woods: Best High School golfer from OC?

Post by joefutbol » Thu Mar 16, 2017 1:40 am

MDDad wrote:I think that may be a personal conclusion unsupported by any real evidence.
From 1965 to 1990 the average round for the CIF champion was 71.1. During Woods run from 1991 to 1994 it was 68.8. From 1995 to 2013 the average round for the CIF champion was 67.1. The runners-up who faced Tiger averaged a 70.3 (with one of those years being played at a par 71). From 1995 to 2013, for all the years I could find, the runner-up averaged a round of 68.

In his closest championship the runner-up never broke 70 against Tiger. The year he didn't win, the champion shot a 73. The two rounds of 68 he had were at Canyon Country Club. The finals were held there from 1997 to 2007 (I couldn't find the location in 2006, so I'm just assuming). Putting his round head to head against the golfers of those 11 years at the same course he would have lost eight times with two ties and only one victory. In four of those years the runner-up would have posted a better score than Woods (I couldn't find the complete scores for three of the years so it may be more). Cantlay posted a 66 and a 68 in his back-to-back championships, and he did it at longer courses with tougher ratings. If you had a time machine and put Cantlay and Woods head to head in their senior years, my money would be on Cantlay. But, we can't do that, so I don't have any real evidence to support my opinion.

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Re: Cantlay vs Woods: Best High School golfer from OC?

Post by MDDad » Thu Mar 16, 2017 7:19 am

Joe, while I appreciate the research, you’re arguing one side of an issue that’s discussed by commentators on PGA tour telecasts at least once or twice a month. The conclusion is always that improvements in golf club and ball technology are the primary factor in today’s longer shots and lower scores. When a golfer can hit a drive 30 to 50 yards farther than players did a generation ago, it stands to reason that scores would go down. Just because guys like Paul Goydos, Stuart Appleby, Justin Thomas and Adam Hadwin have recorded rounds of 59 in the last few years doesn’t mean they’re better golfers than Jack Nicklaus and Ben Hogan.

So when you put Patrick Cantlay into that time machine and send him back a quarter century to play Tiger Woods when he was in high school, be sure to send along a bag of today’s clubs and a sleeve of today’s balls for Tiger to use. Then let’s see what happens.

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Re: Cantlay vs Woods: Best High School golfer from OC?

Post by joefutbol » Thu Mar 16, 2017 2:24 pm

Well, Johnny Miller is one of those commentators, isn't he?
Johnny Miller wrote:I just think that the time is past when any one man will dominate the game. There are too many good players for that to happen now


The technology has gotten better, but the courses are much longer and a whole helluva lot harder now. Scores on the tour have only improved about .2 strokes in the last 25 years while the handicap of the average golfer has dropped by 1.9. Guys may be driving the ball 30 yards farther, but accuracy if far more important in today's game. And ball and club technology didn't change significantly at all from Tiger's 1994 CIF title to 2001, during which four of the five CIF champions at the same course posted lower scores.

There are over 5 billion more people on the planet today than when Hogan was playing. The best player of a generation would likely be as good or close to as good as any best player in any generation, all things being equal. But there are just more players playing at a level comparable to Hogan or Nicklaus today.

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Re: Cantlay vs Woods: Best High School golfer from OC?

Post by Omar Bongo » Fri Mar 17, 2017 5:20 pm

Woods didn't have to shoot the lowest score he could, he just had to beat the guy closest to him
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Re: Cantlay vs Woods: Best High School golfer from OC?

Post by joefutbol » Fri Mar 17, 2017 5:35 pm

It's high school golf, Omar.

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Re: Cantlay vs Woods: Best High School golfer from OC?

Post by ocfootballfan » Fri Mar 17, 2017 5:51 pm

Joe.......I like most of what you say but Cantlays career will never match up to Tigers. Patrick is a fine player but Woods is a once in a lifetime type player.

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Re: Cantlay vs Woods: Best High School golfer from OC?

Post by Omar Bongo » Fri Mar 17, 2017 7:08 pm

It's high school golf, Omar

???
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Re: Cantlay vs Woods: Best High School golfer from OC?

Post by joefutbol » Fri Mar 17, 2017 8:10 pm

ocfootballfan wrote:Joe.......I like most of what you say but Cantlays career will never match up to Tigers. Patrick is a fine player but Woods is a once in a lifetime type player.
Very few,if any, will. I'm talking about high school, specifically. In Cantlay's junior and senior years he played 8 rounds of CIF golf.... and was 38 under. Yes, 38 strokes under par in 8 rounds, including a round of 64 en route to back-to-back CIF titles and a state championship. Only Cantlay and Woods have won back-to-back CIF titles since the 1950s, and Cantlay did it against a much deeper field. A lot of the young talent that exists today is because of Tiger and how much he did to make the game popular 15-20 years ago. The comparison/debate is not crazy.

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Re: Cantlay vs Woods: Best High School golfer from OC?

Post by joefutbol » Fri Mar 17, 2017 8:12 pm

Omar Bongo wrote:It's high school golf, Omar

???
They have to shoot the lowest round they can, it's not like there is a live leaderboard.

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Re: Cantlay vs Woods: Best High School golfer from OC?

Post by Professor Fate » Mon Apr 17, 2017 7:11 pm

Two months and four days after starting his comeback, Patrick Cantlay has passed the $1 Million mark, with a $338,000 payday in the RBC Heritage Tournament. He finished tied for 3rd and now has made $1,064,997. Nice!
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Re: Cantlay vs Woods: Best High School golfer from OC?

Post by Professor Fate » Mon Nov 06, 2017 12:18 am

MDDad wrote: by MDDad » Mon Mar 13, 2017 11:50 pm

Cantlay is a great talent, he may go on to become an outstanding pro, and finishing second in any PGA tournament is a remarkable achievement. But to be completely honest, with only two of the world's ten best golfers, and seven of the top 30, the Valspar had one of the weakest fields I've seen in quite a while.
Here it is! Servite's own Patrick Cantlay has won the Shriners Hospitals for Children Open, winning a sudden death playoff over Alex Cejka, and Meen Whee Kim. His winnings...$1,224,000

Congratulations Patrick!

Image

Santa Margarita's Beau Hossler had a great tournament also, tied for 7th 2 strokes back.
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Re: Cantlay vs Woods: Best High School golfer from OC?

Post by joefutbol » Sun Feb 18, 2018 3:59 pm

Three of the top four players in the world played in the Genesis Open this weekend. Cantlay outplayed all of them and finished fourth.

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Re: Cantlay vs Woods: Best High School golfer from OC?

Post by Omar Bongo » Mon Feb 19, 2018 12:18 am

Lots of players "outplayed" those three guys this weekend...Aaron Baddeley outplayed the #1 player in the world and finished tied for 14th

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Re: Cantlay vs Woods: Best High School golfer from OC?

Post by inflagrantedelicto » Mon Feb 19, 2018 6:37 am

Bongo,
Are the words "Congratulations", "Nicely done", or "Good job" in your vocabulary? Or is hypercritical behavior your ever-present state of mind when it comes to judging the accomplishments of young athletes and/or their efforts?

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Re: Cantlay vs Woods: Best High School golfer from OC?

Post by MDDad » Mon Feb 19, 2018 9:00 am

Congratulations, nicely done and good job to Patrick. It's always cool when a local dude makes good, which makes it such a mystery why Servite fans never mention Santa Margarita's Beau Hossler and his run this season.

And while Patrick's set-up routine isn't as infuriating as Sergio Garcia's 10,000 waggles used to be, his endless left-right-left-right-left-right weight shifting before every shot, including putts, is a little hard to watch.

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Re: Cantlay vs Woods: Best High School golfer from OC?

Post by joefutbol » Mon Feb 19, 2018 10:04 am

Probably for the same reason you, unprompted, don't either. Or maybe because he didn't make the cut this weekend. Either way, congratulations Beau.

Or as Omar points out, Baddeley's accomplishment is unworthy of praise. And since he's ranked #205 in the world, ahead of Beau Hossler, by default we cannot congratulate Beau.
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Re: Cantlay vs Woods: Best High School golfer from OC?

Post by joefutbol » Mon Feb 19, 2018 10:12 am

Omar Bongo wrote:Lots of players "outplayed" those three guys this weekend...Aaron Baddeley outplayed the #1 player in the world and finished tied for 14th
If by "lots" you specifically mean "seven," two of whom are former #2 ranked players in the world, then sure...... "lots" did.

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Re: Cantlay vs Woods: Best High School golfer from OC?

Post by Professor Fate » Mon Feb 19, 2018 1:48 pm

Beau Hossler is a good, but inconsistent golfer. He missed the cut by 3 strokes (he was 5 over). His previous tournament (AT&T Pebble Beach Pro-Am) was most indicative of what I am saying. He was on fire in the first two rounds, and found himself at, or near the top, at -10. He went through the first 43 holes without a bogey. But then he went 7 over par the remaining 29 holes and finished Tied for 43rd at 5 under.

There have been other similar instances.

I've never seen him take even one swing, but I'd guess his weakness is in his head. Perhaps he needs to learn to put a bad stroke or hole behind him and concentrate on what's in front of him. But... he's younger than Cantlay, and he may yet become a great golfer.

In the meantime, Beau has already earned $821,376.00
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Re: Cantlay vs Woods: Best High School golfer from OC?

Post by ocfootballfan » Mon Feb 19, 2018 5:10 pm

Dad........funny you should say that. We were talking about it post round yesterday. I think it’s just a nervous pre-swing tic.

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