Was it terrorism or was it not terrorism?

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John Q. Public
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Was it terrorism or was it not terrorism?

Postby John Q. Public » Sun Dec 24, 2017 11:46 am

Egyptian-American in Harrisburg, PA shoots at cops and hits one. The "acting spokesman" for DHS calls it terrorism and blames chain immigration. The police and the FBI are still investigating and haven't issued statements. The right-wing press has jumped on the terrorism and chain immigration stories but the mainstream press hasn't.

We know he was a naturalized citizen from Egypt, but beyond that we know nothing about him, other than that he's dead. Noting on his motivation, nothing on his religion and nothing about a manifesto or even a Post-It about allegiance to ISIS. But we do know that he was only targeting cops. There were civilians in the area and he first started shooting near a Catholic church, but he didn't shoot at either. Only cops.

So, was it terrorism or just a guy with a grudge and a gun? If he was white he'd just be a psycho, but we know the bar is much lower for minorities and it's especially low for people with Arabic names. Until I hear otherwise I'm going with "grudge and a gun" but I'm a little disturbed that the guy from DHS would automatically call it terrorism and make it political. The police and the FBI know that that isn't their job but I guess DHS is different.


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Wabash
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Re: Was it terrorism or was it not terrorism?

Postby Wabash » Sun Dec 24, 2017 12:31 pm

John Q. Public wrote:Source of the post but we know the bar is much lower for minorities and it's especially low for people with Arabic names.

So true. There's a story in today's WaPo about a white teen being charged with killing his girlfriend’s parents. They had worried he was a neo-Nazi. No one is talking about him being a terrorist or radicalized. He's white.
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Re: Was it terrorism or was it not terrorism?

Postby broman » Sun Dec 24, 2017 1:08 pm

About those Visas..

Family Preference Immigrant Visas (Limited): These visa types are for specific, more distant, family relationships with a U.S. citizen and some specified relationships with a Lawful Permanent Resident (LPR). There are fiscal year numerical limitations on family preference immigrants, shown at the end of each category. The family preference categories are:

Family First Preference (F1): Unmarried sons and daughters of U.S. citizens, and their minor children, if any. (23,400)
Family Second Preference (F2): Spouses, minor children, and unmarried sons and daughters (age 21 and over) of LPRs. At least seventy-seven percent of all visas available for this category will go to the spouses and children; the remainder is allocated to unmarried sons and daughters. (114,200)
Family Third Preference (F3): Married sons and daughters of U.S. citizens, and their spouses and minor children. (23,400)
Family Fourth Preference (F4): Brothers and sisters of U.S. citizens, and their spouses and minor children, provided the U.S. citizens are at least 21 years of age. (65,000)

As the first step, a sponsoring relative must file a Petition for Alien Relative, Form I-130 with the Department of Homeland Security, U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services (USCIS).
https://travel.state.gov/content/travel ... sas.html#2

It seems to me it would have been easier for the Trump administration to slow or stop the petition and vetting process without the public announcements and boogeyman tactics.

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Re: Was it terrorism or was it not terrorism?

Postby John Q. Public » Sun Dec 24, 2017 1:10 pm

Wabash wrote:Source of the post No one is talking about him being a terrorist or radicalized. He's white.

No, that was a simple murder. There was nothing about it that even hints at terrorism.
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Re: Was it terrorism or was it not terrorism?

Postby Wabash » Sun Dec 24, 2017 1:29 pm

True. But at some point in time he was radicalized by an ideology. Which is what is claimed of those who adhere to radical Islam.
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Re: Was it terrorism or was it not terrorism?

Postby Vilepagan » Mon Dec 25, 2017 4:05 am

The word "terrorist" has lost much of its meaning.
There is no fire like passion, there is no shark like hatred, there is no snare like folly, there is no torrent like greed. - The Dhammapada

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Re: Was it terrorism or was it not terrorism?

Postby John Q. Public » Mon Dec 25, 2017 8:05 am

Two days and still no word on if this was politically motivated, which is a requirement for using the word "terrorism," or whether the guy was Muslim or Christian. But until there is, the DHS statement does fill the requirements for using the word "bigotry".
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Re: Was it terrorism or was it not terrorism?

Postby Tommy Tar » Mon Dec 25, 2017 9:52 am

I can't find any post on the New York terrorist attack in October that killed 8 but you guys jump all over this. --:--
‘I Haven’t Seen Democrats This Mad Since We Freed the Slaves!’..... Rob Schneider.

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Re: Was it terrorism or was it not terrorism?

Postby John Q. Public » Mon Dec 25, 2017 10:12 am

No posts about the guy from Modesto, either. Not a lot to say about them, other than that we need to step up the fight against radicalization. But both of those could justifiably be called terrorism - this one can't if there's no evidence found that would justify it. Until there is, the DHS statement was very irresponsible and, yes, bigoted.
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Re: Was it terrorism or was it not terrorism?

Postby John Q. Public » Sat Dec 30, 2017 5:08 pm

HARRISBURG, Pa. – An Egyptian immigrant who wounded a Pennsylvania state trooper and fired at other police officers before being killed has not been connected with any organized terror group or terrorist activity, a prosecutor said Thursday.

Friends and relatives of Ahmed Aminamin El-Mofty have described him as depressed over a lack of family contact and money problems, Dauphin County District Attorney Ed Marsico said.

“At this point in time there is no known nexus to any organized terrorist group or terrorist activity,” Marsico said.


http://www.pressconnects.com/story/news ... 108975742/

Suicide by cop. NOT Terrorism.
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Re: Was it terrorism or was it not terrorism?

Postby John Q. Public » Sun Dec 31, 2017 10:01 am

Five cops and two civilians shot, one deputy killed in Colorado. No word on the shooter's ethnicity or immigration status yet, so we don't know whether it was terrorism or just a citizen defending himself. :roll:
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Re: Was it terrorism or was it not terrorism?

Postby broman » Mon Jan 01, 2018 1:22 pm

Looks like another disgruntled angry vet with mental illness. Not time to talk guns or
mental health. --:--

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Re: Was it terrorism or was it not terrorism?

Postby Bick » Tue Jan 02, 2018 11:05 am

How about talking about this instead?

Chicago saw nearly a 16% decline in murders in 2017 from the previous year, according to statistics released in the early hours of New Year's Day.

The city recorded 650 murders in 2017, a drop from 771 murders in 2016 -- which had been the deadliest year in nearly two decades.

The Chicago Police Department attributed the decrease in murders and shootings to "hard work by officers, adding more sworn personnel, investing in new technology to drive our smart policing strategy, and increasing partnerships."
In 2017, the city had 2,785 shooting incidents and 3,457 shooting victims, which was a decrease from the 3,550 shooting incidents and 4,349 shooting victims in 2016, according to the newly released statistics.

In 2017, more than 1,100 new police officers were hired and the entire department was trained on a revised use of force policy, according to Chicago police.


http://www.cnn.com/2018/01/01/us/chicag ... index.html

Boots on the ground v. yet another law seemed to be a helluva lot more impactful on the biggest gun violence issue this country faces.

Stuff like this, surely doesn't help the cause. He sure seemed proud of it though. Maybe it's better to keep the bad guys in jail?
Last edited by John Q. Public on Tue Jan 02, 2018 11:14 am, edited 1 time in total.
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John Q. Public
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Re: Was it terrorism or was it not terrorism?

Postby John Q. Public » Tue Jan 02, 2018 11:17 am

That's nice, but the thread is about DHS calling the incident in PA "terrorism" based solely on the guy's name.
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Re: Was it terrorism or was it not terrorism?

Postby John Q. Public » Tue Jan 02, 2018 11:56 am

And then there's the right-wing press, who've yet to issue a correction or, heaven forbid, a retraction.
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Re: Was it terrorism or was it not terrorism?

Postby Wabash » Tue Jan 02, 2018 12:25 pm

Nor will they ever. They know their audience is a bunch of old white folks who are scared of dark skinned males. Especially if they are knee grows.
They told me if I voted for Hillary Clinton the president would be emotional, impulsive, and unpredictable. They were right. I voted for Hillary Clinton and got a president that is emotional, impulsive, and unpredictable.

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Re: Was it terrorism or was it not terrorism?

Postby John Q. Public » Tue Jan 02, 2018 12:34 pm

He was an Arab.
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Re: Was it terrorism or was it not terrorism?

Postby MDDad » Tue Jan 02, 2018 1:15 pm

Wabash wrote:They know their audience is a bunch of old white folks who are scared of dark skinned males. Especially if they are knee grows.

JQP wrote:He was an Arab.

Besides the fact that he was an Arab, it was a stupid generalization to begin with. Nothing like starting the new year with a knee-jerk put-down.

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Re: Was it terrorism or was it not terrorism?

Postby John Q. Public » Tue Jan 02, 2018 1:35 pm

And a knee-jerk put-down of the audience rather than the message. Two years after the "deplorables" idiocy and some of us still haven't gotten it.
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Re: Was it terrorism or was it not terrorism?

Postby Wabash » Tue Jan 02, 2018 1:42 pm

The hard core base of Trump supporters have only themselves to blame for their stereotypes. Especially when they march with Nazi and CSA flags and Trumps proclaims some of them as "very good people."
They told me if I voted for Hillary Clinton the president would be emotional, impulsive, and unpredictable. They were right. I voted for Hillary Clinton and got a president that is emotional, impulsive, and unpredictable.

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