ventura wrote: ↑Sat Oct 24, 2020 1:55 pm
Joe - with regard to my voter ID desire, I've answered about vote harvesting. You evidently don't agree that's a form of fraud.
I don't. What definition of fraud would ballot harvesting meet?
ventura wrote: ↑Sat Oct 24, 2020 1:55 pm
I can't prove a negative. If everyone connected with vote-counting isn't super dedicated to honesty/integrity, how could you be sure blocks of votes aren't just thrown away on the mail-in system?
In California, you can track your ballot. If a significant number of ballots are thrown out, the odds it goes unchecked or unnoticed could literally be zero. Can you give me an example of how someone could throw out enough ballots to make a difference and we wouldn't find out?
ventura wrote: ↑Sat Oct 24, 2020 1:55 pm
wouldn't you admit this mail in deal is untested
I wouldn't agree. It's been around in one form or another since the 1600s. Can you tell me how it
hasn't been tested? Mail-in-ballots are filled out, sent, and counted identically to mail-in-ballots. You think there might be a reason Republicans are saying one is safe and the other isn't? I bet if we check the statistics on who is most likely to vote by absentee ballot and who is most likely to vote by mail-in ballot we can get to the bottom of it.
ventura wrote: ↑Sat Oct 24, 2020 1:55 pm
There's fighting in the streets already. I'm afraid any way it goes is going to lead to fighting, and mail in voting will be cited, with either a Trump or Biden victory.
I don't think it happens with a Trump victory. I also don't think that's a good enough reason to restrict access to voting.
ventura wrote: ↑Sat Oct 24, 2020 1:55 pm
As with many of the arguments I post on this board, I'd love to be wrong. I'd love to believe the election will be as honest as any could be. I'd love to believe the government is good, and they have our backs on COVID. I just don't.
I don't care if I'm right or wrong... I'm probably wrong as often as I'm right. I care about the truth. That's why I've asked the same question trying to get an answer over and over and over again. It's a sincere question.
ventura wrote: ↑Sat Oct 24, 2020 1:55 pm
I honestly believe there are those so enraged by Trump, and so convinced he's evil, that it's conceivable they'd think it's for the greater good to cheat. Hell, there are probably some on the conservative side that would do that as well. Mail in voting helps that argument, IMO.
If you can explain to me how they could possibly cheat and get away with it, that would help the argument 10,000x more.
ventura wrote: ↑Sat Oct 24, 2020 1:55 pm
I've answered that while not perfect, presenting an ID at a polling place to a live person, having that person mark you off in front of your eyes, passes the eye test for me more than mail in. One is equal to the other in your eyes?
I really don't care either way. If you can explain it, then great. I'd agree voter fraud is a problem and we need to address it. But if you can't then... how is it a problem?
Let's say you, Ventura, are one of those people you described who think Trump is evil and you think cheating is for the greater good. You're intent on cheating and on your way to the polls and there is no voter ID check in place. What do you do?